Interview (Part 6): Leigh Cesiro and Erica Matlin
My interview with 2021 Black List writers for their script Cruel Summer.
My interview with 2021 Black List writers for their script Cruel Summer.
Leigh Cesiro and Erica Matlin wrote the original screenplay “Cruel Summer” which landed on the 2021 Black List. Recently, I had the opportunity to chat with Erica and Leigh about their creative background, their script, the craft of screenwriting, and what making the annual Black List has meant to them.
Today in Part 6 of a 6-part series to run each day through Sunday, Erica and Leigh share some tips about the craft of screenwriting.
Scott: I got a few craft questions for you. How do you all come up with story ideas? Story concepts? Do you keep a file or you’re proactive about it? Is it just like you’re drifting along and something pops in your head?
Leigh: Especially with the project that we’re working on now, it was a combination of being in the pandemic and re-watching the stupidest, in the best way, comedies from the ’90s and stuff from the early 2000s, like Austin Powers, and being thirsty for more of those. I guess just noticing what kinds of things were making us laugh and finding a story in that.
Erica: I think that’s right. I think we are very different people, we both have our own processes, but we spend a lot of time talking together. It’s like, what are the things that stick, and what’s the thing that’s going to carry from one day to the next, and in the midst of keeping track of all the days in a pandemic? [laughs]
Scott: You mentioned that you’ve learned a lot writing this first script together. What are your strengths, respectively? Do you have an understanding of what each of you brings to the writing process?
Leigh: My instinct is to do more comedy all the time and only that. Erica is more, what are the feelings, other than that it’s funny, that go with it?
Erica: I was going to say the exact same thing.
[laughter]
Scott: There you go.
Erica: Leigh is very diligent about putting in the hours, putting in the time, and making sure we are working. It helps keep me in check. Working with a partner is very rewarding in that because you’re not just in a bubble.
As we said, I’m more feelings-based and those feelings can go off the deep end and some of the jokes can go off the deep end. It’s finding a way for them to come together is our sweet spot, at least with us working together.
Scott: You serve as you’ve got these bumpers that keep you, one of you is like, “OK, we need to have more feelings,” and “OK, we need to have more jokes and whatnot.”
The dialogue in the script is great. It’s so much fun and the characters do have distinct personalities. Do you think dialogue is something that is you either have it or you don’t or do you think it’s something you could develop? How do you find the voices of your characters in writing?
Leigh: The good thing about working with a partner is that you can read it back and forth to each other and hear it, instead of keeping it in your head. If you write something, you can bounce it off someone immediately and hear it out loud.
Erica: In addition to that, reminding each other this is who this character is and that’s how they’re going to speak. This is how that character is and that’s what their feeling is or their perspective is in this scene. Checking each other and your characters in each moment throughout.
Scott: You mentioned scene, I was going to ask you, do you have an approach or a conscious awareness of, “OK, we’ve got a scene. This is what we’ve got to accomplish?” Do you have any goals in mind when you sit down to read a scene or you just feel your way into it?
Leigh: Always going in with what the goal of the scene is, so that you can get in and get out without getting lost but still having room to find new things. t does help a little bit to explore when you’re in the scene and find new things.
Then if that happens, you adjust the goal of the scene, but we do go in with, this is the scene where X happens, and then to know that that’s what we’re working towards so that we can move on.
Erica: Then when we’re further along into a project, then we’re able to call them chunks. This needs to happen in this chunk and then it’s less overwhelming to have something happen in a specific scene.
Scott: Chunks, yeah. I guess, that’s a different way of saying sequence…
Erica: Yes. That’s more elegant.
[laughter]
Scott: Elegant. There’s that word again. But I like chunk. I’m going to use that for now. It’s much better. I know that Leigh has written some TV pilots. Is that an area of interest for you? Writer’s room, eventually running a TV show?
Leigh: Yeah. That was my goal, in the beginning, was TV and then this was a very happy detour that has proven fruitful. TV was my original focus and still have that going, with pilots I think you’re expected to churn them out quicker than a feature. There’s the pressure of that. But yeah, TV is still a goal.
Scott: Erica, same thing or no?
Erica: Writing features feels where I’m most comfortable. The level of collaboration that Leigh and I have together has made me way more interested in TV, even if that was not my original goal or intention.
Scott: A final question: Based upon your experience of what you’ve done so far, what advice would you offer to someone who’s an aspiring writer trying to break into the business?
Erica: I would tell someone to keep writing, to just write and rewrite. Don’t be afraid to share your script with people so that you can get a better sense of where you’re going and find the ways to motivate yourself and find the right people to help motivate you. It is scary, it’s very vulnerable, but it also can be rewarding when you go for it.
Leigh: I would add, it’s fruitless to try and write something that you think seems like Black List fodder or bait in that way. I guess there are trends, but it’s not worth the energy of trying to guess what will get on there.
Instead, the energy is better used writing what you have a good time writing and doesn’t feel like a chore.
Also being OK with being bad for a while, and working through that and getting better. There’s that Ira Glass Ira Glass quote. Do you know that?
Scott: Yeah.
Leigh: I feel like it’s imprinted in my head, that you have to accept that you will be bad in the beginning and keep working through it. Eventually, things will click and the story that you see in your head, you can get it out on the page.
Scott: That’s some great advice. The stuff that you have a good time writing, it’s like, you’re going to get paid, hopefully at some point. Oftentimes, you’ll get paid to write stuff that’s not terribly motivating. If you’re doing it for free, for sure.
Leigh: Especially when you’re not getting paid, you should enjoy it.
For Part 1 of the interview, go here.
Part 2, here.
Part 3, here.
Part 4, here.
Part 5, here.
Twitter: @leighcesiro, @eribmatlin.
For my interviews with dozens of other Black List writers, go here.