Interview (Part 6): Daniel Hanna

My interview with the 2021 Nicholl Fellowships in Screenwriting winner.

Daniel Hanna wrote the original screenplay “Shelter Animal” which won a 2021 Nicholl Fellowship in Screenwriting. Recently, I had the opportunity to chat with Daniel about his creative background, his award-winning script, the craft of screenwriting, and what winning the Nicholl Award has meant to him.

Today in Part 6 of a 6-part series, Daniel talks the craft of screenwriting and provides advice for aspiring screenwriters.

Scott: A few craft questions for you. How do you come up with story ideas?

Daniel: Usually, for me, there’s a little bit of a lightning bolt that comes between a world colliding with a genre, or a character colliding with a world. I’ve realized it’s hard to answer. I’ve had trouble always answering because I write in a lot of different genres. What is the unifying thing?

For me, what I really love is exploring a subculture. A subculture or a world, and then how people who I think are universal in their types and in their wants and needs and all these things, how they are wedged into this subculture or world, and how do they grow because of it. You definitely can see that in Shelter Animal.

And I love writing characters. I love inventing people, exploring people. That usually comes easily for me if I know these are the circumstances of the world and the challenges of it.

Scott: It brings to mind how Pixar is big on their whole subculture thing. Let’s do a movie about monsters. Although, they subvert the expectation.

Daniel: Totally.

Scott: It also sounds a little bit like that outsider dynamic we were talking about earlier. Outsider coming into that environment. I know you mentioned that you like different genres. You’ve got some horror movies like there’s a project “They Live on Skid Row,” and it’s a zombie thing in Skid Row, right?

Daniel: The impetus for where that came from was, in LA, as everyone knows, housing prices have gone through the roof. There are a lot more people living in tents and that kind of thing.

I had the little lightning bolt one day that we’ve gotten so good at ignoring it that if literally there was a zombie outbreak occurring in that community, we would not notice because we would be looking the other way. It was a darkly comic, horrifyingly funny idea to me. Absurd is a better word than funny. That was where that sparked.

Then I was thinking of an outsider character again in that world. A girl and her brother coming into that world and having to figure out how do they acclimate to and survive Skid Row as people not used to living on the street. Then that’s all combined with a horror zombie escalation across the night. That’s how that fits.

Scott: Reminds me a bit too of how Stephen King approaches it. He doesn’t like plot. He likes situations. What’s the situation? I get the character in there and then I just go. Does that resonate with you a little bit?

Daniel: It really does. Then the story and the plot comes organically in a way because you have a certain character and a certain situation, and something’s got to happen and something’s got to change. You see where they go with it, and that’s, for me, the fun part is seeing where it goes and then later figuring out, was that the best effect that we could do with it?

Scott: You mentioned that you love writing characters. You mentioned, too, you like to knock out 20 to 60 pages before you start getting into the story structure.

Is that freewriting, the primary form of how you access your characters? Is there some other character development technique or approach that you’re using? Is it also, once you’ve gotten the raw material you do that executive thinking, are there’s things that you do there in terms of shaping the character’s development?

Daniel: I would say it’s starting with the raw material. Obviously, you have something already that clicked into place for whatever reason that made you want to start writing, but usually, it’s vague. I will be writing, exploring to see how characters respond to situations, who are the other people in their lives, and how do they bump up against them.

I’ll write through and let them talk and see, are they quiet, are they loud, are they funny, are they shy, and let it play out. Then later you put on a different hat and you say, “OK, but what really is their greatest fear?” You’re looking at it and thinking these are the things we’ve developed here.

This is the part where they came alive, and I’m seeing their greatest fear is that something will happen to their little brother or sister or whatever it is. In a way, it’s a risky approach in that you can get locked into things, perhaps, or get too attached to something.

At the same time, you have to trust the process and trust your subconscious a little bit. That’s where things will come out that you never expected and the things that are somehow driving you to write it in the first place. You don’t want to miss the opportunity to do that from a place of freedom from structure, first, second, and third act breaks, and all that stuff.

Scott: All that stuff, yeah. People complain all the time like formulaic writing, and what better way to avoid that than by leaning into the characters. It’s like Ray Bradbury says, “Plot is nothing more than just following the footsteps of your characters in the snow.”

Daniel: Right. That’s great.

Scott: How about dialogue? I was so impressed with your dialogue. Molly is very different than Diana, is very different than Petra. How do you go about or do you even think about it? Is it just a natural thing? Have you gone about trying to develop your ability to writing dialogue?

Daniel: It’s a combination of both. It’s something that I always liked, and I think having the different backgrounds, seeing the different speech patterns of people in Arkansas versus Canada versus Ireland. Very specific speech patterns that I always liked and was interested in that. It’s something naturally that I’m always wanting to explore.

It’s like, “OK, now I get to write a new character. I get to give them a different voice and see who they are.” A lot of it is seeing what they say and what they want to say. For instance, Diana was a boring character in early drafts.

She was a little goofy or whatever, but on this rewrite I was like, “This is our opportunity to have fun with her. Let’s have her not mince any of her words and let it all fly.” She’s probably got a Southern vibe to her, too, at least in my mind. Some of it is because I want to make every character count and give them something fun to say and talk about and express themselves.

It’s just something I really enjoy in film, too. I love the Coen brothers and how they’ll do that. Every character has their little tics or nuances. I guess the more you write and the more you watch and see how other people write, you go, “Oh, I should do more. I should push myself further in that direction if I can.” Then take the opportunity when you have it.

Scott: How much do you pay attention to that in terms of the scene description?

Daniel: You are, first and foremost, in a script, trying to give people a good reading experience and take them on a journey. There’s the rules like “don’t say what people are thinking,” that kind of thing. Everyone knows you have to find your own way of where to draw that line.

For me, you know when you’re watching a movie if someone is silently feeling something, you know it. We have non-verbal cues that clue us into things like that, and so you need to take people on that journey, too, in the script. That’s how I try and approach it. I want to make people feel like they’re going to feel if they were watching the film.

Scott: One last question. What advice can you offer to an aspiring screenwriter or filmmaker about learning the craft, breaking into Hollywood?

Daniel: The first thing is you have to write, and you have to write a lot. I think I’ve probably written something like 10 scripts. Then this was a whole rewrite pass. I would say the most important thing is being true to why you want to write the story.

Finding a story you’re passionate and excited about. Then holding on to the aspects of it that excite you because it is easy to whittle them away either through putting it into a structured box that’s a little too rigid. I also think that we have to keep pushing it further, and further, and further, and not get too satisfied either.

It’s a weird balance between making it more formulaic and also not pushing yourself enough to make it as strong or tight or engaging as possible. There’s one book I like. It’s “The Anatomy of Story” by John Truby, which I’ve recommended to a lot of people because it’s very much not about trying to write a formula. It’s encouraging you to challenge yourself to write the best version of the story the way you want to write it. It can be a good exercise to challenge yourself with that and make sure you’re pushing yourself as far as you can.

Also, accountability in a writers’ group goes a long way because then you have to turn in pages. You’re getting feedback. Just so long you can stay true to what you want and not what other people want, then it’s a great part of the process. Then you have your first audience, and having an audience can be really motivating and inspiring.

For Part 1 of the interview, go here.

For Part 2, go here.

For Part 3, go here.

For Part 4, go here.

For Part 5, go here.

For my interviews with every Nicholl Fellowships in Screenwriting winner since 2012, go here.

For my interviews with Black List writers, go here.