Interview (Part 3:) David L. Williams

My interview with 2022 Black List writer for his script Clementine.

David L. Williams wrote the screenplay Clementine which landed on the 2022 Black List. I had the opportunity to chat with David about his creative background, writing a Black List script, and the craft of screenwriting.

Today in Part 3 of a 6-part series to run each day through Sunday, David explores what were the creative roots for some of the key characters in Clementine.

Scott: Speaking of mama bear, you mentioned Rico, who is her estranged husband. She’s even gotten, if I recall, that she got a restraining order about the guy.

David: Yeah.

Scott: There’s the daughter, five‑year‑old Sandy. Maybe you could describe that situation and that kid.

David: Sandy is a reflection of all the kids like myself, frankly, who’ve grown up with a parent who is somewhat abusive, whether they’re abusive against the other parent or herself or both

She’s a good person. She’s going to grow up to be a sweet person, but she’s also a fighter. She’s someone who feels like, even though she’s five years old, she has the need to defend her mother the same way that when I was five, I had to defend my mother from my father. That’s who Sandy is to me. Maybe she’ll be an artist like her mom one day.

Scott: That’s one of the nice moments in there is the unicorn thing, where they’re doing the sketches and all that stuff. She is a fighter and she does get involved in there, because she’s also rambunctious and push backs in with her mom when it comes to eating the little crackers and stuff.

What about the diabetes thing? Was that a conscious thing? You give the mom a wound, she gets shot in the first scene. It’s not life‑threatening, but it’s something she has to deal with. The diabetes is also like a ticking clock. Was that a conscious decision to add that?

David: That was inspired by a note. Fun fact, the script in its current form is the second draft. In the first draft, Sandy wasn’t sick. In the second draft, someone gave me a note of like, “Man, I feel like something’s kind of missing. What if Sandy was sick or something?”

Yes, it was a conscious decision to give her specifically diabetes, though, because I’m somewhat familiar with diabetes. I don’t have it personally, but my grandfather does. Sometimes I’m drawn to stories, and I’ve been drawn to people who have diabetes, and I do feel that empathy for them. That was perfect for the script.

That’s the kind of thing that not even cancer can threaten your life that quickly. Cancer is more of a prolonged kind of thing. Diabetes, if not treated within hours, it’s life‑threatening too. That became a tool, a very inspiring tool. It also just kind of bolstered her tenacity because she is sick, but she will still defend her mom.

Scott: Let’s talk about this other character, you introduce as “demented‑looking Sicaria, woman in her 40s with one hell of a scar across her face.”

Clementine not only is trying to accomplish a goal. She’s also being chased. Maybe you could talk to us a bit about the Sicaria character.

David: Sicaria is probably the biggest swing I take in the story. She is inspired by, again, all those tropes from movies in the same genre, but with that twist that it’s not necessarily a hit man. It’s a hit woman. I thought about making it a guy. When I was in the middle of writing, it was a dude. Then, I was like, what if it’s a woman?

This is terrifying. Her drive, even though it’s subtle, it still has to tie in with motherhood. She does this for her son who passed away. I wanted someone who’s badass, very terrifying, someone who was almost mechanical in their execution, almost like a “Terminator” character, but a female. I would say, if anything, maybe the Terminator is what inspired this, someone who is a go‑go‑get‑it‑done machine.

Scott: In her bad ass black car…

David: Unstoppable, she is.

Scott: I don’t want to give away the ending, but a couple plot twists I want to get your thoughts on. First of all, there’s a twist. It’s about page 60 in, where we think Clementine is dead. Sandy ends up with Sicaria for 15 pages, a really interesting shift.

Before we get to the Clementine thing, let’s go over to Sicaria. Something interesting happens in that little sequence because she’s taking care of this girl. That’s when we learn that she had the son. You start to feel sympathy. You start to feel some positive energy toward this hit woman. Were you consciously trying to elicit sympathy for that character?

David: That’s a really good question. So much of the script came to me as I was writing, so these are all things I would want to see in this movie. If I was seeing it in a theater, I’d want to know more about this character. I don’t want to stop the thrills or the pacing in order to do it. That’s why there’s that tattoo.

It’s my way of being able to complicate her and her situation. Because of what she’s lost, it’s a little harder for her. She makes it look easy, but it’s not easy, [laughs] we know, what she’s doing, and the mental boundary she has to vault to get the job done. I don’t want to jump the gun about whatever other questions.

Basically, for a second, I had no intention of bringing Clementine back. As I was writing, it felt very natural to me that it reached a boiling point and she dies. When you think about it, what’s the worst thing that can happen? That’s it. This is it. She’s gone. [laughs] It wasn’t like all the other decisions.

It was a matter of, man, what would be the most entertaining thing for me if I was watching this movie in theaters? Then, I thought to myself, it would be pretty badass if she came back.

Scott: She wasn’t whispering in your ear, “David, come on man. I’m not dead yet.”

[laughter]

David: No.

Scott: Like in Monty Python and the Holy Grail: “I’m not dead yet.”

David: That’s so funny. One of the producers even suggested, when it was first optioned, he was like, “It’s almost like her motherhood transcends life and death.” The same way that Sicaria is completely unstoppable, maybe motherhood is inspiring Clementine to be the same.

Scott: The script is an action script, no doubt about it, but at its emotional core, it’s a mother‑daughter story. You explore that with Zacaria, too, which is great, because you humanize this, what in effect, is a nemesis character. I always tell my students that great line, which is, even bad guys have moms.

David: That’s so true.

Scott: I was very impressed with not only how Clementine was so mama‑bear‑focused on this kid, but the interaction moments, not the action moments, the interaction moments, are quite touching. Could you talk to me about the mother‑daughter relationship and how you wrote that?

David: First of all, I wanted to find something a little unique. I wanted the down time to not just be down time, but that they’re doing something a little productive. I grew up around very similar people. I grew up in a predominantly Black neighborhood, but also had a lot of Hispanic descent as well.

I had the opportunity to see mothers exactly like that, who interact with their children by doing things that they love, whether it’s playing tennis or something, or singing, playing music. This reminded me of that, of a mother being able to share something with her daughter.

It’s probably the one thing in all these hard times that she’s able to share with her, and it not be just for the practicality purposes or just trying to find money. It’s her way of reminding her daughter that there’s art in this world, no matter what’s happening, she can find time to express that and invest in it and confide in it as well. That’s what inspired those moments.

Scott: Do you have children of your own?

David: No, I don’t have children.

Scott: Because it was very impressive. I’ve got two, they’re adults. I was like, these little moments where she’s having to negotiate with her daughter about the crackers and stuff, and like that.

As parents, we’ve all been there. But you’re not a parent. How did you manage to create such an authentic dynamic between mother and daughter?

David: Sometimes, not all the time, but for some characters I almost employ this actor mentality, of being almost like a method actor. When I go in to write a character, I try to feel and breathe that character when I’m writing them. It is a mix of, I’d say, it’s mostly those observations, for sure. I was so immersed in those kinds of people, and I’m grateful for that.

It’s that, but also an ability to, or rather a desire and a want to, feel and breathe that character on the page and make people feel as real as possible. That’s my goal with those scenarios.

Scott: That’s great. I’m going to cite this with my students, because I’m always telling them, “There’s the world out there. Get off your phone and just observe,” because if you’re a writer, that’s where you’re learning stuff.

Here’s a guy who doesn’t have kids, he’s a guy, not a girl, and he’s able to in the script, write a relationship, a mother‑daughter relationship, that comes across as very authentic. More power to you.

David: I appreciate that.

Tomorrow in Part 4, David talks about what it meant for Clementine to make the 2022 Black List and the current status of the script.

For Part 1 of the interview, go here.

Part 2, go here.

David is repped by Verve and Gramercy Park Entertainment.

Twitter: @storytellerdave

Instagram: @davidgem

For my interviews with dozens of other Black List writers, go here.