Go Into The Story interview: David Boxerbaum

An extended conversation with one of Hollywood’s top literary agents.

As Go Into The Story readers likely know, I track the spec script market. Every February since I launched the site in 2008, I do an in-depth analysis of that year’s deals, but in fact, I have been tracking spec script deals since 1991. You can go here and find 2,000+ such deals stretching back nearly three decades.

[Note: It’s an inexact science, but I do the best I can given my information resources.]

Following the market, the names of certain agents and managers pop up more frequently than others. David Boxerbaum is one of those names.

David is a senior agent at VERVE Talent & Literary Agency. Since we follow each other on Twitter and Facebook, I reached out to David to see if he would be willing to talk about the state of the movie business, specifically the spec script market. Here is a transcript of our in-depth conversation.

Scott: Let’s just jump right into it. How did you get interested in the entertainment business?

David: I’ve always loved movies. I’ve loved the silver screen. It’s something that I fell in love with at a really young age.

I went to film school at NYU with the idea of being able to make movies, write movies, direct movies, and be a part of that whole entire industry and process. Just a pure joy behind the art of it.

When I got into the mail room at William Morris, I realized this was an amazing way to be a part of the business because it was the hub of it all. Everything was filtered through the agency space. You get to have your hand on everything. That’s where I think I’ve found my true calling, which was to be a sales agent.

Scott: That was your first gig in Hollywood, the mail room at William Morris?

David: Actually not. After film school, I came out to Los Angeles and I got a job working for Jerry Bruckheimer Films, which was a ‘Welcome to Hollywood Unbelievable Entry into the Business’ job because it was the time when he was doing Armageddon, Con Air, Enemy of the State.

All these amazing big movies, action movies that now you’re looking back, they were the high‑concept style of what movies were back then. That was my first introduction to Hollywood.

That’s when someone was like, “Listen, if you really want to learn the business, you’ve got to go mail room.” That’s when I went to work at William Morris.

Scott: You’ve got a reputation of being one of Hollywood’s top agents when it comes to handling spec scripts. If you had to take a guess how many spec scripts you’ve set up ‑‑ sales, options ‑‑ could you even come up with a number?

David: [laughs] You know, Scott, and this is coming from a very, very, very humbling place ‑‑ I am truly humbled by the fact that I’ve had so much success in that space. Thankfully, they’re ninety-five if not more percent sales, not options.

Nothing wrong with an option, but a lot of them have been straight purchases, which has been very rewarding financially for the clients and for my career as I moved along. I wish I could give you a number. I don’t even keep track. I never did.

For me, I’ve always had this mentality. It’s just my work ethic and the way I was trained and raised, which is, I always say, “That was Tuesday. Now what’s Wednesday?” If I sold one on Tuesday, “OK, that was all right. Celebrate it. Act like you’ve been there. Let’s go on to Wednesday now. You’ve got other things to do.”

I never kept track, don’t keep tallies. I just d0 my job and work as hard as I can as I always do for every client. It’s been a lot of deals, and I’m, again, humbled by it.

Scott: You recently were involved in a spec that got set up, “Ruby,” written by Kat Wood. Described as Rapunzel meets The Raid. How did you bring that to market and how did that sale work?

David: So that one, Kat wrote that on spec and she’s a really unbelievably gifted writer. I work closely with her with another colleague of mine, Pamela Goldstein. We read the script and knew there was something really special there in what she Kat written.

She wanted to write a female empowerment action movie like John Wick or Long Kiss Goodnight.

We knew we wanted to bring on an all‑star producer to also be a part of it, give it a brand. Every spec has its own process. Every spec you go through your litany of strategy and thoughts and ideas.

This one, we thought bringing on a producer early to maybe help shepherd it would be a smart play, so we brought it to 87North, who jumped all over it. They were unbelievable. That’s David Leitch’s company along with Kelly McCormick and Annie Marter, who are amazing.

They jumped onboard. We all then strategized and started talking about actresses. We gave it to a few agents who represent some high‑end actresses. Before we knew it, we had a number ‑‑ if not more than a handful, ten or fifteen actresses who were all jumping up and down trying to be a part of it.

We already knew we had something really special on our hand. Now we knew we had something even more special.

We then talked about taking one of those actresses, possibly attaching and going to the studios, but because we had something so special in the script itself, the written word was just jumping off the page. We had so many options with the actresses that maybe it was right for one studio, but wouldn’t be right for another ‑‑ we decided to take our chances and show it to the studios and see what that would bear.

There were quite a few offers and Amazon won the day with a very competitive buy. It was really special. An amazing opportunity for Kat, a life‑changing deal. It was great.

Scott: It sounds kind of like almost a throwback to the old spec script days.

David: It was, to an extent. Throwback would be more of like, “OK, I’m going to take this out to forty-five producers overnight. I’m going to get reads overnight. In the morning, everybody’s going to come chasing it. We’re going to pick out, ‘OK, you get this territory. You get that territory.’ We’re going to go into all studios, and we’re going to have all studios compete.”

There’s something similar to it, sure. In this situation, we had one producer. We then went to all the studios, held an auction, if you want to use that word, and then had the big offer from Amazon, which was great. We had multiple offers as well, but Amazon really stepped up.

Scott: It seems like that’s a trend now ‑‑ female leads.

David: Yeah, I’m seeing a lot of that in the marketplace right now. It just happens to be that the action female‑led comedy, female‑led ensemble comedy, female‑led thriller ‑‑ all those movies seem to be a little more appetizing to the buyers than the male lead. If you add in a diverse female, it’s even more appetizing.

I don’t want to say it’s a trend. It’s something that should have been there since the incarnation of movies. It should always be about female‑driven as well and female‑forward. I’m a firm believer in female‑led movies and especially in female empowerment projects.

I’m excited about this, I guess you want to call it new trend that’s happening in the marketplace and especially in movies.

Scott: I broke into the business selling a spec in 1987. You’ve been around during the golden era of spec scripts.

David: [laughs] I have.

Scott: The market’s in a state of decline, I think that’s fair to say. What are the factors contributing to that?

David: Listen. I don’t want to be a Pollyanna here, but I think the market’s actually been really wonderful lately. I think we’ve had a lot of big success. Now, I think we’ve been strategic in success, especially speaking for only myself. I’ve tried to be very strategic in everything I’ve worked on.

As we’ve seen, to your point, less buyers, the pandemic has clearly affected it all when it comes to theatrical and now the streaming boom and all of that. Because of all those rises and decreases, we’ve seen maybe less of a need for content. Because of that, you’re going to see less specs get bought.

You have to be more strategic. You have to be more focused on how you take things out. The days of just slinging things out against a wall every week and seeing what happens are few and far between, if not gone.

Still happens, and there’s still opportunity to sell something in a big way ‑‑ again, I could give you numerous examples over the last year or two that we’ve had success as an agency, but just that day of taking things out and going to fifty producers, like I talked about earlier, and having a big spec sale, they’re few and far between.

Now it’s about being more strategic, knowing that there’s fewer buyers, knowing that people have less money to spend, knowing that there’s less content that’s going to be put on in theatrical ‑‑ clearly, right now we don’t know what the theatrical window is now, and that the streaming really is the play.

You got to be more focused. You got to be more forward‑thinking in the way you put forth material and be smart about it.

I think that’s changed a lot, where, again, back in the golden era, as you called it, sometimes a script could just be ‑‑ the concept alone ‑‑ the script may not work. The characters may not work. The dialogue may not work. The script doesn’t really make a lot of sense, but the concept alone is so great, you could just take it out and sell it based on that.

Now, I think that has completely fallen by the wayside. A script has to be there. Everything element of a script has to be in place now.

Scott: I’m wondering whether one of the contributing factors to let’s say the lessening of the spec market is Hollywood’s obsession with preexisting content ‑‑ remakes, reboots, prequels, sequels, shequels. I had a producer once tell me recently that he considered original content to be “untested” ‑‑ that they want this preexisting IP. Are you finding that to be the case?

David: I agree with you. I agree with that concept. Not untested ‑‑ I wouldn’t use that word. I would agree that yes, there was a time there when it was clearly almost impossible to sell anything original.

Original IP was literally impossible, original content, where it was all about IP sequels, threequels based on comics, based on this remake, all of that.

Now, I don’t know if it’s the pandemic or whatever it may be, or this new era we’re in, or streaming, where the library of trying to fill up with original content that you can then make into a possible sequel or possible franchise ‑‑ I have seen a boom in original pieces of material being sold.

Doesn’t mean that IP is still not king. I think IP is always going to be king, but I have absolutely seen a bigger boom right now in original pieces of content, which should absolutely be music to everybody’s ears out there that’s a writer or a creator or artist.

Scott: That’s actually a nice segue into a question I wanted to ask you. Obviously, it’s competitive to get spec material set up. What would be your take for an aspiring writer out there ‑‑ the value of writing spec scripts?

David: The value is if you truly call yourself a writer, someone who wants to become someone that spends their professional days scripting material, there’s no greater value than continue to hone your craft, continue to write spec after spec.

Yes, you may have one great one you write that becomes the one that you sell, whatever, but you’re always honing your craft. You’re always working on what you do.

There’s no greater way of doing that than by continuing to get up every day and write and create new content, new material, and write new specs, because you never know. It could be the first one, it could be the 9th one, it could be the 20th one, could be the 4th one. Whatever it may be, hopefully, it’s one of those. If the talent is there, talent will find its way to hopefully get set up in some capacity.

Continuing to churn out new material is the key to everybody who wants to be successful, I think, in this business, as a writer, as a creator, like I said, because it’s about continuing to work on your craft as a writer, as a storyteller.

Scott: A lot of times pro screenwriters, when they’re asked the question, “What should I write,” they’ll tell aspiring writers, “Write what you’re passionate about,” which is obviously smart because they got to be passionate.

David: Yeah, sure.

Scott: As you know, there are a lot of writers out there who track the market and they’re genre writers…

David: Right, the trends.

Scott: What’s your advice on that?

David: Listen, I’m much more in the “Write what you’re passionate about” camp because to me, it really depends what you’re trying to accomplish. But if you’re a new writer trying to break into the business, getting representation, getting noticed, whatever it may be, to me, writing what you’re passionate about is writing what speaks to you. It speaks to your soul ‑‑ what inspires you.

To me, that’s going to be the best thing on the page you can possibly write because if you just write the trend, you’re not writing what excites you every day.

No. When you get up in the morning, you want to say, “I’m so excited. I can’t wait to jump back into that character. I can’t wait to get back into that dialogue. I can’t wait to get back into that scene I’ve been writing because it inspires me. It gives me the joy to be able to tell this story.”

To me, that’s what any good writer should write from, write from a place of passion. I’ve always been an agent that’s been driven by character and dialogue, first and foremost.

Character and dialogue comes from some of the people who write the most passionate stories, the things that speak to them the most and can be sometimes the most harrowing experiences ‑‑ the things that have scared them, excited them, have saddened them in life, or made them happy.

It’s always writing from that place of passion, of storytelling that to me is what I’ve always found to be the most probably rewarding for any kind of artist.

Scott: My take is character‑driven screenwriting, storytelling. It’s everything…

David: Yeah. I agree with you.

Scott: Okay, how about this. A manager once told me that the way to think of the difference between an agent and a manager is that an agent wears a suit, and a manager wears blue jeans.

David: [laughs]

Scott: What’s your take on the agent‑manager thing?

David: Right now, I’m wearing sweats and a T‑shirt, so I don’t wear a suit anymore, but that’s all changed with the new world of the pandemic. That’s very funny that the person would say that. That is maybe one small and I think incorrect aspect of what makes the difference between an agent and a manager.

To me, the line is so blurred. Maybe you think an agent really is out there hunting and gathering and doing deals and getting material out there, while a manager is there to help shepherd and mold and create with the writer, help with their ideas.

Those lines are so blurred these days that I don’t think that tends to be the truth. What I do is wear all of those hats. I’m speaking only for myself. I can’t speak for any other agent. I don’t want to speak for any other agent. I’m speaking only for myself.

I believe that I love to get my hands dirty from the kernel of the idea to the movie premiering and you’re there with your client watching it on the big screen. For me, it’s about the sell. It’s about the shaping of it. It’s about the draft, the notes, the strategies, all of that. A good manager would say the same that they do the same.

Well, the line’s gotten a lot blurred over the years, and that’s okay with me because a team that is in lockstep and works well together is a team that’s on the same page. If you’re all doing the same thing, that’s exciting. You have the same goal as an agent or manager for the clients.

Scott: One last question, I’m sure you get this one all the time. Aspiring screenwriters trying to get their foot in the door and establish themselves. Do you have one piece of advice on what to focus on?

David: Yeah. Listen, I say this. It sounds like it’s preaching something that seems almost unattainable, but it isn’t. I always said, great material rises to the top. The cream rises to the top, and it finds its way. The only way that can’t happen is if you give up, is if you throw in the towel.

To me, great writers write to continue to hone their craft, continue to work on their material, continue to churn out new amazing pieces of art that other people aren’t doing because they’re sitting back on their royalties waiting for someone to come to them.

I also think that you need to immerse yourself in the business. Screenwriting contests, screenwriting groups, immerse yourself with other people who are doing what you’re doing, so you feel like you’re surrounding yourself with that energy every day.

I’m immersed in my world with agents, artists, creators, and people who speak my language, share the same interests, and we speak together. That’s exciting to be a part of every day.

As a writer, that’s similar to same way of other writers having friends who are doing what you’re doing, have all those people around you at all times. To me, that’s what you need to do as a writer.

Many people don’t do that. They focus on just trying to write something and hopefully something happens with it. Long term for a career, you’ve got to immerse yourself in the business as much as you can.

Some solid takeaways:

• Write stories from a place of personal passion, yes, but also immerse yourself in the business. In my view, that means read the trades, devour interviews with screenwriters and filmmakers, listen to podcasts like Scriptnotes, and yes, read Go Into The Story.
• Find other writers with talent and passion, create a community, maybe even a formal writing group. Writing is a lonely gig. It’s beneficial to have the support of people who understand the ups and downs of the writer’s life.
• Let your characters drive the story-crafting process. Great characters not only serve as actor bait, they also know the story better than you. Follow their lead into and through the writing process.
• Finally, per David, there’s hope for both the spec market and original material. That should provide some motivation for you!

Twitter: @DBoxerbaum.

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